I see anyone who believes in sin and expiation quite much as Farnese of Berserk. They'd be great if they leave that crippling belief, they'll find many advance and start to see the world as it is.
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@sathariel i think sin is real, i mean what else would you call the act of raping kids and eating them?? 
@Loki something really fucked up and these guys are mad. But as you can see they are stupidly rich and probably will never face consequences from their wicked acts.
@Loki but if you want to call that sin I don't have any problem.
@sathariel @Loki what did you think I meant by sin lol. I dont believe in original sin, but everyone enters life with good and bad karma or else they wouldnt be reborn. to sin is to go against dharma and thus disturb rita. God has a perfect system of justice and one must live in harmony with the universe. of course sin can't touch a yogi but for others we are liable.
@georgia I don't know most of the weird words you use and I think it's better to avoid using them and explaining in a more simple language. I don't think one expiates sins through suffering, that's ridiculous and counterproductive. Suffering is inherent to existence as joy. Purification is very real though, as karma, that I see as things stored from your existence and other existences that avoids you to act in concordance with God's will, and while there isn't place for conflict I won't call it justice, that's just a very human desire.
@georgia I think there was a name for doing or action yoga, I don't remember the name. But that's the more effective imo.
@sathariel karma yoga is what youre thinking of, the path of action. deliberately self-inflicted suffering doesnt expiate anything, but suffering inflicted by the world burns up bad karma. thats how hell works! if people who are used to getting bad shit from the universe didnt get some reward for their suffering it wouldnt be a fair system.
@georgia hell exists only for sadistic and masochistic desires
@sathariel various hells exist appropriate to purify people of various sins but normally a bad birth on earth is enough
@georgia nothing is purified through suffering.
@sathariel yeah we won't agree on this matter but thats okay
@georgia @sathariel often suffering breeds suffering if we look at the real world, various "cycles of violence". Any way arent you into the whole intercessor idea, you can never truly pay for your wrongs unless you can admit you need the help of the intercessor.
@technolyze @sathariel I dont believe anyone needs an intercessor actually I think everyone can have a personal relationship with God on their own
@georgia @sathariel then what the fuck did jesus die for?
@technolyze @sathariel I'm not a christian but I think jesus was one of many avataras sent and to be sent down to Earth to promote righteousness. He died for three reasons imo.
1. so he could be resurrected, showing the triumph of God over natural forces like the burning bush, and showing believers that they too could conquer death (through bhakti yoga)
2. to amplify his message of universal love by dying for his friends
3. because it was Gods will to start a religion that promotes the bhava of God as savior / suffering servant, creating christianity which would lead many people to dharmic conduct and eventually to liberation
1. so he could be resurrected, showing the triumph of God over natural forces like the burning bush, and showing believers that they too could conquer death (through bhakti yoga)
2. to amplify his message of universal love by dying for his friends
3. because it was Gods will to start a religion that promotes the bhava of God as savior / suffering servant, creating christianity which would lead many people to dharmic conduct and eventually to liberation
@georgia @sathariel i think its its just as likely he was just a freaky dude with a drug and sex cult
@technolyze @sathariel you know if you just want to be provocative there are better ways
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@georgia @sathariel i see you and your lot are talking down to others again, have fun, l8r
@technolyze @sathariel you say my lot and I really dont know who you mean. I also didnt mean to talk down to you I just dont appreciate being trolled