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Phantasm

Phantasm

@phnt@fluffytail.org remote
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Once you deal with taking care of computers for normies, all the BS Microsoft does to force down updates on users makes instantly sense.

Automatic updates? No brainer, otherwise they will never install them.
A limit on how far you can delay installing updates? Again, they will never get installed if you can just say "ask me later" all the time.
Removal of Shutdown/Reboot without installing updates? They will never be applied even when they are scheduled to install.
Phantasm

Phantasm

@phnt@fluffytail.org remote
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The only solution is to give a "power user" option for administrators on clean install that disables all the crap for people that know how to use computers. It must not be changed after install, or user account creation since they will do that once rumors of the mythical power user mode come to light. Or allow a "power user" administrator to change it afterwards for other users.

Phantasm

Phantasm

@phnt@fluffytail.org remote
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Tangent: To my knowledge Linux DEs not supporting the whole "administrator with root privileges is another user" that Windows has is a large mistake. If I install Mint for someone that just opens a browser once a week and enable automatic updates for them, they shouldn't be allowed privilege escalation rights, but instead a separate "admin" user (me) should have those (with a different user password of course).

If you want to make the year of the Linux desktop happen by letting normies use it, at least make the experience for the people administering those machines simple and not allow users to shoot themselves in the feet. Polkit in DEs is basically useless by not supporting this. It might as well not exist unlike UAC which is great.
Phantasm

Phantasm

@phnt@fluffytail.org remote
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@benis_redux The dialogs don't allow you to change the user you are authenticating with. They all use the logged in user with the logged in users password. When an unprivileged user on Windows triggers a UAC prompt, it asks for the password of the administrator, not the unprivileged user.
GNU/翠星石

GNU/翠星石

@Suiseiseki@freesoftwareextremist.com remote
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@phnt @benis_redux >When an unprivileged user on Windows triggers a UAC prompt, it asks for the password of the administrator, not the unprivileged user.
`su «user»` asks the password of the relevant user (which can be privileged), not the unprivileged user.

Just alias `sudo` to `su root -c` and change /etc/pam.d/su to; "auth required pam_wheel.so group=su use_uid" if `sudo «command»` is the only use case - all users in the su group can run something as root, if they know the root password.

GNU's functionality where you can login as whatever user via `su` from root, is 1 million times superior, as you can actually install, fix and test things for the user, without needing to know their password.
Phantasm

Phantasm

@phnt@fluffytail.org remote
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@Humpleupagus @benis_redux @Suiseiseki
>If you want to make the year of the Linux desktop happen by letting normies use it, at least make the experience for the people administering those machines simple

Dicking around with ssh while I'm possibly not even on the same network (remote desktop exists), or dicking around with PAM is not simple in any definition of the word. No idea what is so hard to understand about a GUI prompt asking you for an administrator's password instead of the user's being simple and easy to use.
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